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Do you consider...canon?

Fatal Frame Series Spirit Camera Shadow Priestess A Curse Affecting Only Girls Zero Movie Opinion Poll

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5 replies to this topic

Poll: What do you consider canon? (10 member(s) have cast votes)

Do you consider the new material canon?

  1. just the movie/novel (2 votes [20.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  2. just the manga (3 votes [30.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.00%

  3. both are canon (2 votes [20.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  4. neither are canon (3 votes [30.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.00%

Do you consider the Raven Haired Shrine Maiden (5th game) canon?

  1. Yes, its canon. (5 votes [50.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 50.00%

  2. Yes its canon, but it replaces the 3rd game (making the 3rd game not canon). (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  3. Yes its canon, if I ignore Miu's origin. (5 votes [50.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 50.00%

  4. No it isn't canon. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

Do you consider Spirit Camera canon?

  1. Yes it is canon. (6 votes [60.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 60.00%

  2. No its not canon. (4 votes [40.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 40.00%

  3. It isn't even a true Fatal Frame game. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#1 OFFLINE   MacabrelleEnvy



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Posted 17 February 2015 - 05:47 PM

Now that there is a bunch of new material to go with the series, what do you consider canon? Do you gladly accept all new material or do you pick and choose? Do you think some of the new material replaces what was once accepted in the older installments?


Personally, I have mixed feelings about the new material. I've watched let's plays of the fifth game and some of it was very interesting, but then some of it just didn't feel quite right to me. One certain part of that game *cough Miu cough* I want to burn in a fiery death. With the manga, however, I absolutely love it so far. Even though it is a bit different from the games, it still feels like them! I have not watched the movie yet, but to my understanding the novel was basically the same thing and I didn't like it very much. The camera has a back seat to fan service in the novel and though some of the elements are there, the move from a haunted setting to one still fully functional in society just doesn't seem to fit well at all. Also, I know a lot of people didn't like Spirit Camera (and for good reason), but the more I think about its potential the more I feel like it would have fit into the series perfectly if it had been done right. If we aren't thinking about the game play at all, but simply consider story I feel like the atmosphere and back story aren't far off the mark. Lastly, I like to think that the first four games are still canon (though I wasn't so fond of the 4th one until I was finally able to play it). If I ignore that one small part of the fifth game then all is well! Lol.


What do you guys think?

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#2 OFFLINE   midwinter


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Posted 17 February 2015 - 10:26 PM

Ooh, good thread. I'm really interested to hear what people have to say.


I think Spirit Camera's probably the only one where I'd argue with someone who said it didn't count. I won't get upset if people reject the manga or the novel - there are good reasons for doing so, and it's not like this is a fandom where you have to be familiar with every offshoot story to discuss the others. These things will probably never come up again.


Hmm. Now that I think about it, it's less of a dichotomy between canon and not, and more like a sliding scale, or a hierarchy. I'd say the games created by Shibata and Kikuchi are like the "core" canon, where I couldn't pick and choose even if I wanted to. It's no secret I hate the stuff about Miku in FF5, but I can't go into a happy headcanon space where none of it really happened, and it's very difficult to push it to one side and ignore it because Miku is such an important character for me. So I'm stuck accepting it, even though I maintain it conflicts with FF3, and although I would prefer to say "no thanks, from now on we pretend this never happened", my brain is still busy coming up with horrible reinterpretations that make it plausible. On some level I apparently think that the integrity of canon is more important than my enjoyment of it. With the games, there's a sense that it's canon whether I like it or not. Even the contradictory stuff has to be made to fit somehow. I wouldn't feel any such urge with the novel or manga. Not sure about Spirit Camera; I guess I'll find out where it sits on the hierarchy if a future main series game contradicts it, but it's hard to imagine how that would happen.


That said! Personally speaking, my default position is to absorb as much new canon as possible, because I like a big universe with lots of possibilities. I can handle a mediocre story, or one like Spirit Camera that's not very well fleshed out, or even something like the movie/novel where the usual emphasis and themes are shifted. As long as the things I like are there in some form or another, I can mentally bring them into the foreground and enjoy speculating about them. I really like the manga, not so fond of the novel, love Spirit Camera, but I throw them all in the pot without discrimination. If the games are "core" canon, the other stuff is like a swirling cloud of optional canon, which I'll generally accept unless there's a striking reason not to.  I think in some ways it's easier to be generous and accept everything extra because I know it probably doesn't matter, and won't have any consequences in the games. I can decide which bits to pay attention to and ignore the rest. The fact that it's supplementary to canon makes me more willing to accept it as canon.


...Um. Does that make any sense whatsoever?


The only thing I have no difficulty rejecting is crossover characters. They could have Karatsu and Makino as the main characters in Fatal Frame 6 and Ayane as the final boss, and I would still never acknowledge them. UNCLEAN.

#3 OFFLINE   MacabrelleEnvy



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Posted 18 February 2015 - 03:50 PM

I had completely forgotten about Ayane >.< Yeah, I pretty much just place that in "side games that have no influence on the series" like the minigames, mission modes, survival mode, and haunted house modes.

I also like your term of "optional canon" for non-core-game material. It allows for more comfort in our individual opinions and like you've stated thy probably will have no bearing or influence on future core games.

As far as Miku and Miu, I am just so disappointed in how things turned out. Also, i'm not sure how I can accept the craziness that seems to be involved in her conception so I treat it like the "folklore" that it is. Some people can believe wholeheartedly in the Lochness Monster but don't believe in Mothman or Bigfoot. I'm going to accept that it is around in someone's beliefs but i'm still skeptical.

Edited by MacabrelleEnvy, 18 February 2015 - 03:56 PM.

#4 OFFLINE   ナガクラ


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Posted 19 February 2015 - 01:24 PM

I'll keep this short and simple because I dont feel like explaining how I feel about Spirit Camera again because some people were barking at me last time about it. Spirit Camera, the manga, novels, and the films take place in their own universe so not cannon. The main series games (Fatal Frame 1-5) are all cannon in my eyes. Done. Zip. DOnt bother asking me why I think Spirit Camera is not cannon cuz I will not answer. Deal with it. K, bye.

Edited by ナガクラ, 19 February 2015 - 01:26 PM.

Anti-Operation Zero

#5 OFFLINE   Hex


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Posted 28 February 2015 - 01:03 PM

The frustrating thing about 5's additions to the mythology, including yomiko, is that I really like most of it on paper.  It's useful to have more depth and names for the psychic stuff, or a new perspective on Pillars, but that one bit of folklore works against previous games so jarringly, it's difficult to overlook in a way that makes both seem possible.  I do accept it as canon, but I think it's totally fair to call it out as bad writing and OOC for returning characters (or lack of them - Rei, where are you?).


I don't see an issue with SC being canon at all, if anything using "Dr. Asou" in the original title seems to suggest it was.  As almost a quick summary of 1-4's themes and ideas, nothing stands out as being too out of universe or contradictory to reject it.  Plus, a canon with WiB is a better canon imo.


I second the love for the manga, it could easily have featured in the game some way.  The novel and movie/s are no doubt their own thing, and it's just my personal preference they don't be canon because...sixth sense periods, but the manga really seems to get what it is.  Optional canon is the best term to describe it, definitely.


The only new media I wouldn't invite to the party would be the novel.  And Ayane.

#6 OFFLINE   AnimalLover47999


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Posted 06 November 2015 - 03:47 AM

I consider Spirit Camera canon, I consider the movie canon, and I consider the Manga canon.  I consider everything about the 5th game canon but with a different interpretation on what the stuff involving Miu and Miku (as in Miku wanting to be a mother someday and has this nightmare as a way of her thinking what the worst outcome could be and when she wakes up she reaffirms she'd never do such a thing and continues living on a happy good normal life with her friends.) was about therefore preserving and saving the original intentions and making it so that 3 is still the end to her story.  Something not canon or existing and not being in the same universe are two different things but I would like to think that things like the Zero novel, Eiji's fanfiction' I mean A curse effecting only girls, and everything about the Zero 3 Comic Anthology excluding Musubi and Tsuzuri's story (and maybe Haruka Kuze's story although that one's stretching it) are not canon.


I just hope the next game doesn't do something where I'll need to come up with another interpretation in order for everything in the fifth game to technically happen but still keep everything the series stands for to be the end of the story and to not be destroyed.

Edited by AnimalLover47999, 06 November 2015 - 08:45 PM.

Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Fatal Frame Series, Spirit Camera, Shadow Priestess, A Curse Affecting Only Girls, Zero Movie, Opinion, Poll

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